Fellowship of Presbyterian Gathering
Breakout session discusses
‘presbytery within presbytery’ option
By Paula R. Kincaid, The Layman, August 31, 2011
MINEAPOLIS, Minn. – “Presbyteries within presbyteries,” was one of several options discussed at the Fellowship of Presbyterians Gathering, held last week.
Peter Barnes of Westlake Hills Presbyterian Church in Austin, Texas, was the first to speak at a breakout session held Friday.
“We’ve talked a lot about context,” said Barnes. “If you find yourself as an evangelical in a hostile environment then you will deal with this in a different way than an evangelical in a more friendly presbytery.”
Mission Presbytery
Barnes introduced Larry Coulter, senior pastor of Shepherd of the Hills Presbyterian Church in Austin, Texas, which is a union church between Cumberland Presbyterian Church and Presbyterian Church (USA).
Coulter said that the removal of Amendment 10A was not an issue in his church, since it ordains elders and deacons to Cumberland which is more conservative. The congregation’s property is held in trust between the two denominations. “This gives our people a place to stand that is a little bit different,” he said, “so the pressure is off us.”
Coulter said that people need a place to stand when they are in a crisis of conscience. The question being asked, he said is, “How did I become a part of a denomination that has taken a Biblical turn that is not me?”
The presbytery within a presbytery idea – or overlay presbytery – is “an important thing to do for the churches in our presbytery,” he said. “We have gotten further along than we thought we would get.”
Amy Hanschen, a former parish associate with Hyde Park Presbyterian Church in Austin, Texas, then discussed how the idea of an overlay presbytery began and took root in the presbytery. In January people started wondering about “What happens if 10A passes?” By March, she said ideas started solidifying.
“When the idea of an overlay presbytery came up,” she said, “we all concurred within minutes that would be an option to fully and completely explore.”
Hanschen said that in May, when 10A passed, the group called the presbytery’s executive presbyter and stated clerk, and “we told them that we were examining options because of a crisis of conscience.”
A meeting of like-minded pastors was held in June, and a steering committee was formed. The committee then met with several of the presbytery trustees, council and staff. “They were surprised at all the work we had done. They did not know we were so far along” she said. A second meeting was held in August which included all of the presbytery’s general counsel, all of the trustees and the steering committee.
Hanschen said that the group was even getting support from liberal and progressive pastors in the presbytery: “They wanted to give us a place to stand, as we had allowed them a place to stand for many years prior.”
A presbytery meeting will be held Sept. 17, she said, “for the purpose of listening again.” A presbytery vote on the overlay presbytery is scheduled for the October meeting.
Greater Atlanta Presbytery
Another presbytery that is working with the idea of an overlay presbytery is Greater Atlanta Presbytery. Dr. Marnie Crumpler, executive pastor at Peachtree Presbyterian Church, in Atlanta, Ga., spoke about their efforts.
Crumpler said that in June, a group of like-minded pastors met to discuss their options. “We are not excited about leaving,” she said, and the question was “how to remain faithful and be the church Jesus Christ is calling us to be without leaving.”
All the options that were discussed by the group needed presbytery approval, she said. Crumpler praised the presbytery executive, who she said “did a wonderful job reaching out.”
Two presbytery task forces were formed, she said. The first was a gracious separation task force to determine what gracious separation would look like. It will give a report at the September presbytery meeting. The second task force was on flexible governing.
Of the options presented to the like-minded pastors group by the flexible governing task force, the preferred one was the overlay presbytery option.
“This now has to go back to our presbytery and be voted on and affirmed by presbytery,” Crumpler said. “Is the entire presbytery going to be excited and vote for this?” she asked. She didn’t know, but did say there’s a lot to pray for.
The session ended with the leadership saying that congregations must have good communication and relationships with presbytery leadership.
They said that the PCUSA Stated Clerk Gradye Parsons had ruled that the overlay presbytery option would take a change in thePUCSA’s Book of Order. That process requires a presbytery sending an overture to the 2012 General Assembly, approval by the GA and approval by a majority of the denomination’s 173 presbyteries.
In response to a question concerning what happens if the presbytery or General Assembly does not approve the options, Barnes said, “We push it as far as we can. If they say ‘no’ to this, then we ask what about this, then what about this.”
“We have 10 churches in Mission [Presbytery] asking for this thing to happen,” he said. “If the presbytery says no to them, they will feel like you are saying here’s the door.”
Coulter said that when the discussion first began taking place in Mission Presbytery, the presbytery’s stated clerk wrote a letter to both he and Barnes, saying “cease and desist.” It was the More Light Presbyterian pastors [the liberal pastors], Coulter said, who told the stated clerk to cease and desist.
Coulter said the More Light pastors told the stated clerk “We had these conversations about getting rid of [the fidelity and chastity ordination standard, G-6.0106b] for years … now they need to have those conversations.”
Possible responses to Amendment 10A
There are 173 presbyteries, Barnes said at the beginning of the breakout session, and all have a different context. He called his presbytery – Mission – a “conflicted presbytery.” As an illustration, he cited the presbytery’s vote in 2008-2009 referendum on the ordination standards. It was a tie, 181-181. This past year’s vote was 201-194.
As a result of the vote and other things happening in the PCUSA, Barnes said a list of 11 “possible responses to Amendment 10A” was compiled. The list and Barnes’ comments on one some of the responses follow:
1. Remain in Mission Presbytery, incorporating open ordination guidelines into the congregation’s nominating process and examinations for its officers and new pastors. Barnes said that progressives are doing this now.
2. Remain in Mission Presbytery, taking a “wait and see” approach as the session remains in a season of prayer and discussion to discern God’s will and timing for possible responses. Many churches are doing this, he said, wondering what are the implications of the changes in the denomination.
3. Remain in Mission Presbytery and take no formal action to leave the presbytery or the denomination, instead choosing to maintain the previous ordination standards within our congregation. Barnes said that a number of evangelical congregations are doing this now.
4. Remain in Mission Presbyt
ery and press for the presbytery to return to previous ordination standards that include “fidelity in marriage and chastity in singleness.” He used the Presbytery of Plains and Peaks as an example. It has inserted the fidelity and chastity ordination standard into its sexual misconduct policy.
5. Remain in Mission Presbytery but request to become a “union” church with the Cumberland Presbyterian Church, the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, or a new reformed body. Several churches in Mission Presbytery are union churches with Cumberland. This item has the advantage of requiring no change to the constitution.
6. Request that Mission Presbytery recognize each local church’s “statement of expectations for church leaders” to be used by the individual church for nominating candidates for elder and deacon, and by the presbytery’s Committee on Ministry in examination of candidates for Minister of the Word and Sacrament for that congregation. Neither side – evangelicals nor liberals – are excited about this one, he said.
7. Request that Mission Presbytery (A) adopt a proposal coming out of the Stated Clerk of the General Assembly’s Office which would create “Affiliate Memberships” for persons and congregations with ‘a crisis of conscience in presbyteries, or (B) adopt a proposal authorizing the presbytery to establish separate commissions (called “ecclesiastical orders” by some) to perform the functions of the Committee on Ministry and the Committee on the Preparation for Ministry, etc. Barnes said that both proposals originated in the PCUSA’s Office of the General Assembly.
8. Request that Mission Presbytery transfer the congregation to an adjacent presbytery, which holds to traditional ordination standards. (A pastor may also transfer membership to a separate presbytery, while laboring in the bounds of Mission Presbytery, with the approval of the participating presbyteries.) An example of this response: First Presbyterian Church in Hollywood, Calif., has asked to be transferred to San Diego Presbytery. “Is there a presbytery in proximity to me that I can ask to be transferred to,” is the question, said Barnes. He could not predict if those types of presbytery decisions would be protested and have to be adjudicated in the PCUSA’s court system. “Presbyteries are cooperating with each other right now,” he said.
9. Join with other churches in seeking to organize a new presbytery working with the Presbytery, the Synod, and the General Assembly’s Administrative Commission on Middle Governing Bodies, and remain within the denomination but develop a new formal structure separate from Mission Presbytery. The new presbytery would uphold traditional ordination standards.
10. Request dismissal from Mission Presbytery to join another reformed body that is more conservative theologically (such as the Cumberland Presbyterian Church, the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, the Reformed Church in America, or a new group that may be formed by Presbyterian congregations across the nation.)
11. Request dismissal from Mission Presbytery and become an independent church with no formal denominational affiliation, but open to possible informal association with other theologically aligned congregations.