An interview with professor about Constitutional Presbyterians
By John H. Adams, The Layman Online, October 16, 2006
The Layman Online interviewed Dr. Richard Burnett today about the upcoming meeting of Constitutional Presbyterians. Burnett, who is an ordained minister in the Presbyterian Church (USA), is professor of systematic theology at Erskine Theological Seminary in Due West, S.C. The following are excerpts from that interview.
Constitutional Presbyterians
will meet in Greenville, S.C.
WHERE: First Presbyterian Church of Greenville, South Carolina.
WHEN: Nov. 3-4. Registration 3 p.m. Nov. 3. Program begins at 7 p.m. Nov. 3. Resumes at 9 a.m. Nov. 4 and concludes with worship at 3 p.m. Nov. 4.
FOCUS: Needs and concerns of Presbyterians in the Southeast but open to all.
REGISTRATION FEE: $25. ($12.50 for college and seminary students and anyone 18 years and younger.)
SPEAKERS
- Howard Edington, senior pastor, Providence PC, Hilton Head, S.C.
- Ron Scates, senior pastor, Highland Park PC, Dallas, Texas
- James Logan Sr., Presbyterian elder, Charlotte, N.C.
- Samuel Moffett, professor of ecumenics & mission emeritus, Princeton Theological Seminary.
- Ken Thomas, pastor, Swan Lake Presbyterian Church, Sumter, S.C.
- James C. Goodloe IV, Senior Pastor, Grace Covenant PC, Richmond, Va.
WORKSHOPS
- Why A Constitutional Crisis?: Michael Bush & Christopher Yim
- Why A Theological Declaration?: Richard Burnett & Paul La Montagne
- Constitutional Presbyterianism: Q&A: Steve Moss & Jim Goodloe
- Global Implications: A Missions Perspective: Samuel Moffett & Rob Weingartner
- Healing The Sexual Conflict In Our Church: Ken Thomas & Meleah Allard
- Claiming The Office Of Ruling Elder: Greg Darden & Quay Youngblood
Who are Constitutional Presbyterians?
“Most of us are pastors, elders and a few educators who have been Presbyterians all our lives. We care deeply about our Presbyterian tradition and heritage and share a deep commitment to Reformed theology.
“About 50 of us have been talking for over a year. This started with a Yahoo chat of maybe 25. We studied Calvin’s Institutes, book four, chapters one and two about what constitutes the unity of the church. We concluded that we shouldn’t take the structure of the visible church for granted. This calls into question whether this denomination is going to be called a church.
“The PCUSA may have cut themselves off. It appears that the 217th General Assembly has embarked on a path of schism from the one holy, apostolic and catholic church.”
Who should be interested in attending the gathering of Constitutional Presbyterians?
“Anyone who wants to preserve not only decency and order but also sanity in the Presbyterian Church (USA) should be interested. The fact is that some of us took seriously our ordination vows when we answered, “Will you fulfill your office in obedience to Jesus Christ, under the authority of Scripture, and be continually guided by our confessions?” Many of us still do. We want to serve in a denomination that takes these words seriously and means what they say. We suspect there are others who want the same.”
What do you want to accomplish?
“Our purpose is to educate folks about what has happened since the 217th General Assembly, to inform them of the crisis we are in and its consequences, and to encourage them in seeing and hearing from Presbyterians who also care about maintaining our ordination standards.”
What is the crisis?
“It’s a time of decision as to our very identity as Presbyterians and what our ordination standards are going to be.”
What is the right decision?
“To maintain our historic ordination by defining them and declare where we are by means of overture.”
What would you consider success?
“Winning for us means coalescing of those who are going to abide by the constitution. The 217th General Assembly has issued an authoritative interpretation that mandates that each session and presbytery decide which of our ordination standards are now binding and which are not. They have essentially mandated that we divide ourselves up according to those who will abide by our ordination standards and those who are not willing to abide by those standards. Our intention is to oblige. They said PUP was a gift to the church. We’re going to receive it as such. We did not ask to be divided up into gay and straight presbyteries. They did. They have insisted the church be divided. We didn’t. There are going to be several dozen presbyteries that are going to insist on the standards we already have.”
How many presbyteries do you believe will declare that they will abide by the constitutional ordination requirements in opposition to the General Assembly’s authoritative interpretation?
“When the smoke clears and people figure out what the authoritative interpretation does say, we’re likely to have as many as 70. That’s a wild guess. I’m trying to be encouraging.”
Is this a training conference?
“Yes. We’re trying to equip people how to define ordination and to include a commitment to constitutional standards in their presbyteries’ manual of operations.”
What are the issues beyond ordination?
“The deeper crisis is theological. This is an issue that goes deeper than sexual behavior. The issues are who God is, who Jesus Christ is, what salvation is, and the authority of Scripture.”
Since the General Assembly met in June, this has been a season of discontent for many evangelicals in the Presbyterian Church (USA). You have helped some evangelicals prepare resolutions for their presbyteries declaring that they will abide by the constitutional ordination standards. What can you offer those evangelicals who cannot convince their presbyteries to abide by the standards?
“We realize there are many faithful Presbyterians in non-faithful presbyteries. We have appreciated the many ideas that have emerged from the New Wineskins Initiative. When you’re in the minority and the presbytery doesn’t want to abide by the constitution, they form covenants with each other. That’s what the English Puritans did. They were Presbyterians. They banded together and they were Presbyterians where they were. They didn’t always participate in the other body.”
You mentioned the New Wineskins. They have not formed a new denomination, but they have called for a moratorium in pressure and actions by presbyteries to take the property of congregations that are considering leaving the denomination. How to the Constitutional Presbyterians regard the property trust requirement?
“We’ve got to coalesce first. We’re not out to overturn the trust laws of the state. There are many things we do not like about the constitution. We’re not in love with everything in the constitution. We will abide by the constitution insofar as it is in accord with our final authority, the Holy Scriptures.”
You also attended the meeting of the Global Presbyterians, another group formed in response to the 2006 General Assembly’s authoritative interpretation. What were your impressions?
“We appreciate their efforts to emphasize missions and what God is doing in the global church. They expressed support for our statement about church existing for the mission of the world. We say the church does not exist for her own sake, but lives in solidarity with the world, not in conformity with the world.”
The Constitutional Presbyterians do not publicize a membership list or leadership list to protect individuals from retaliation by the denomination or presbyteries. You are often the spokesman for the group. Why?
“I happen to have the freedom as a professor and am not as vulnerable.”
What are the consequences of what you describe as the crisis in the Presbyterian Church (USA)?
“Worse than our declining membership is the brain drain we have experienced in the PCUSA. There doesn’t seem to be a great deal intellectual vitality among the leadership in the PCUSA. The politically correct ideology has created a disapora of orthodox scholars who can’t get jobs in their own seminaries.”