Article gives insight to the most important part of our work together
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
What a great topic! Your article gives fresh insight and a sense of urgency to the most important part of our work together. I am so grateful for your ministry. I pray that God will richly bless your work as you proclaim the gospel.
Brian Ahier Gateway Presbyterian Church, The Dalles, Ore.
No goals for bringing peace into the Middle East
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
Apparently, religious leaders like Rev. Dr. Clifton Kirkpatrick don’t know that President George W. Bush has no capital now to even initiate a diplomatic peace effort in the Middle East. President Bush does not know the word “peace.”
I don’t believe that President Bush nor his administration had any goals in bringing peace into the Middle East. There won’t be any peace until our Lord comes back at the Second Coming.
Charles Freeman Mississippi
Which is it: ‘The Word of God’ or ‘Nevertheless the words of men’
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
Re: PCUSA pastor on the Resurrection: ‘Maybe a body got up; I don’t care …’
Unfortunately, in the PCUSA, it is not surprising that a pastor dismisses the significance of Christ’s resurrection. There is so much theological confusion in the denomination. Anything is up for debate, and the “essential tenets of the Reformed faith” can be anything you want them to be.
The following demonstrates one core example. In the PCUSA, elders, deacons and ministers of the Word and sacrament must make this vow (from G-14.0207 (c)) in the Book of Order:
- “Do you sincerely receive and adopt the essential tenets of the Reformed faith as expressed in the confessions of our church as authentic and reliable expositions of what Scripture leads us to believe and do, and will you be instructed and led by those confessions as you lead the people of God?”
Because there are no explicit “essential tenets of the Reformed faith,” that vow leads ordained leaders to look to the confessions to determine those “essentials” are for themselves. It specifically uses the phrase “as expressed in the confessions,” so let us delve into what may be considered to be one “essential” question: What is the Bible?
The Confession of 1967 states that:
- “The Scriptures, given under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, are nevertheless the words of men, conditioned by the language, thought forms, and literary fashions of the places and times at which they were written. They reflect views of life, history, and the cosmos which were then current.” (9.29).
This obviously contradicts the Westminster Confession of Faith, which says:
- “The authority of the Holy Scripture for which it ought to be believed and obeyed, dependeth not upon the testimony of any man or church, but wholly upon God (who is truth itself), the author thereof; and therefore it is to be received, because it is the Word of God.” (6.004)
So – which is it – “The Word of God” (Westminster) or “Nevertheless the words of men” (C ’67)? Since the confessions contradict each other on something as essential as what the Bible is, isn’t it easy to see why there is so much debate in the PCUSA on who Jesus is and what he did? How sad.
Kevin T. Smith Once an elder, Renounced jurisdiction of PCUSA in 2006
A possible re-phrasing of sentence?
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
You have “advocating for a congregation’s withdrawal.” I believe correct is “advocating a congregation’s withdrawal” or “campaigning for a congregation’s withdrawal.”
Editor’s Note: The phrase in the story is verbatim from the letter sent by the Committee on Ministry. Andrew Fincke
Thank you for your faithful support
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
Thank you to the Lay Committee for your faithful support of the members of the PCUSA who are stressed by the non-Biblical positions embraced by our denomination.
It appears that an inevitably painful and necessary separation must occur in the near future. The threat of the homosexual membership is relentless in its demands for leadership, and endorsement of their conduct has never been successfully addressed. The PUP report has buried the issues in a morass of political correctness and words with unclear meanings. Leadership by persons who vigorously uphold sinful conduct as acceptable and remain unrepentant can only lead, if continued, to the demise of the PCUSA as a part of the body of Christ in the world.
Whenever I ask myself, “What if they’re right and I am wrong?” I check back to Romans 1 and find the description of homosexual behavior so clear and its identification as sin so irrevocable that I rest comfortably in my confidence and trust in the living and written Word.
BSF International also has been a great help through the study of Scripture and fellowship.
Richard H. Sharrett, M.D. elder, Fanwood Presbyterian Church , Presbytery of Elizabeth
Apology for my terse statement
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
Ref: Is human life sanctified by the life giving Spirit or the life giving womb?
Last week, I referred to this article as “gobblygoop.” I have since reread the article and feel that an apology to Rev. Parks is in order. I must admit that I did not understand all the information. I am not a theologian and this article was way over my head. Anyway, Rev. Parks, please accept my apology for my terse statement.
Bill Arthur Greenville, S.C.
Invite Bush to prayer meeting
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
President Bush ought to ask to be invited to the prayer meeting these folks call – to do the actual praying for the peace of the Middle East. Perhaps once a week would be nice, maybe on Wednesday night, but I doubt it will happen.
Fred Hopson Sacramento, Calif.
Let evangelicals go their way and the universalists go their way
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
How refreshing and wonderful it is to see some churches take the stand to leave the PCUSA. This should have started 10 years ago, not now.
In the article, Dr. Dan Sansbury, in speaking against the dismissal, says, “There are ways to look at all the positions and think differently.” Well, factions of the denomination have been thinking differently for a long time without ever having any hope of thinking the same. So, I would say it is time to think anew and each go their own way.
The Rev. Joe Martin asked them to vote against dismissal so the church and the denomination could have more time to talk. Talk about what? The dialogue has gone on, votes have been taken (three time,s no less) and nobody is listening!
The bottom line is this: There will never be any agreement, there can’t be. We are talking different theologies. There are those of us who believe and stand on sound doctrine and those who take the universalist approach. It is oil and water.
Praise the Lord for Montreat, Signal Mountain and some of the others! The time for dialogue is over, it is now time to act in good conscience and dissolve the PCUSA. Let the evangelicals go their way and let the universalists go their way. The universalists could even start the PCU (Presbyterian Church of Universalists).
Dave Anderson Allison Park, Pa.
Worship Jesus in truth, not at the altar of those of misguided theology
Posted Wednesday, January 31, 2007
Jesus the Christ paid our ransom and we are free to worship him in truth, not at the altar of those of misguided theology. All PCUSA congregations will have to choose. I pray we will be faithful to the one who called us.
Charlotte Edwards Cape Girardeau, Mo.
Pastor openly and continually seeks to deny the Scriptures
Posted Monday, January 29, 2007
Re: PCUSA pastor on the Resurrection: ‘Maybe a body got up; I don’t care …’
Is anyone really surprised by this? This man openly and continually seeks to deny the Scriptures and the Book of Order.
Andrew McCaskill
The issue is our reaction to God’s love
Posted Monday, January 29, 2007
The issue is not God’s love for us as stated in Meghan Foote’s letter [posted Jan. 25, 2007]. It goes to our reaction to his love. Pharaoh comes to mind in the Old Testament, among others like Jesus’ admonition in Matthew 7:13 in the New Testament. A clear example is in Romans 1:18-32, especially vv 24, 26, and 28.
Pete Simpson Bloomington, Minn.
Excited by church’s overwhelming vote to leave PCUSA
Posted Monday, January 29, 2007
I am excited that Montreat Presbyterian Church had an overwhelming vote to leave the PCUSA for the EPC.
Whitney Alexander
Presbytery will shut the door on congregations wishing to leave PCUSA
Posted Monday, January 29, 2007
While I add my prayers of praise and thanksgiving to God for the powerful moving of the Holy Spirit at the congregational meeting in Montreat on Jan. 21, my intercessions continue unabated for the preservation and safety of the members, elders and staff of that faithful church.
Notwithstanding a “super” majority of 92 percent voting for dismissal, the Presbytery of Western North Carolina is poised to amend the “process” it approved only in October and effectively shut the door on any and all congregations that, like Montreat Presbyterian Church, have come to the conclusion that the only faithful thing to do is to leave the PCUSA.
When the proposed amendment to the “process” passes at the PWNC meeting on the 27th in Asheville (as it is all but guaranteed to do), and a 2/3 vote of presbytery becomes the requirement to approve a congregation’s request for dismissal, it will be virtually impossible for any church to leave. The presbytery’s rationale, that such an important matter – a matter that so dramatically impacts the life of a congregation – demands a higher majority than the simple 50-percent plus one majority that was part of the “process” as originally approved by the presbytery in October of last year, rings hollow when one understands that by such action the presbytery is saying is doesn’t care one little bit for the 92 percent of the people who have voted to leave.
I have intentionally put “process” in quotation marks because when the outcome has been decided before the “process” even begins (as is clearly the presbytery’s intent – no one is going to get permission to leave), the term is merely being employed as a glove is to cover a fist.
I urge all faithful, evangelical and orthodox Presbyterians to go to the New Wineskins Association of Churches and read the strategy report. At a time when presbyteries, in submissive obedience to the repressive leadership coming from PCUSA headquarters as epitomized by “The Louisville Papers,” seek to strike down congregations with gloved fists, it is time for us to come together to follow the Holy Spirit’s leadership out of this denomination into the new thing God is doing.
Rev. Jim Wilken Marion, N.C.
PCUSA moved from reformed Christian church to Unitarian liberal church
Posted Monday, January 29, 2007
What is the status of the Presbytery of Pittsburgh’s case, decided by the Synod of the Trinity?
I hope that they have appealed this to the GAC Permanent Judicial Commission or, even better, under Title 15 of the Pennsylvania Corporations Code section 5793, which prohibits corporate officers in non-profit corporations from acting beyond the scope of their enumerated authority, to try to seek an injunction against the Synod of the Trinity.
Our constitution, the Book of Order, sections G-11.0103, G-4.0300, G-8.0400, and G-8.0600, clearly gives the presbyteries original jurisdiction to decide ordination standards and individual congregation’s property rights. So, why aren’t we fighting?
This is such a great church and we serve such a great and faithful Savior in Christ Jesus. We need to mount one last great fight for this denomination through the presbyteries adopting the Constitutional Presbyterians’ ordination standards. Since the presbyteries have extraordinary authority under our constitution, relative to the entire structure of our denomination, they must exercise it and every church session should push for it.
We always have the civil courts to turn to. If we fail, we can go to court to get an injunction and file for a declaratory judgment regarding title to the church’s property. We need to attack the so-called trust itself, since the original grantors’ intent was to establish an orthodox, Reformed Christian church, not a Unitarian church whose followers, by the way, borrow our language but, in fact, their doctrine of the Trinity, their “Jesus” seminar, and their sexuality standards reflect a group of very liberal Unitarians seeking something more out of life.
Each state’s attorney general is empowered by a set of statutes to protect a grantor’s intent in regard to their gifts to non-profit organizations. Our original grantors (those who gave the money and built our individual churches), did not seek to establish Unitarian churches – their intent was to establish orthodox, Reformed Christian churches. The doctrine of “Cy Pres” exists to correct this by allowing assets to be transferred to organizations or denominations more in line with the grantor’s original intent.
Our leadership has moved us from an orthodox, Reformed Christian church to a liberal Unitarian church, intent on liberal good deeds, but that is where their similarity to Christianity ends. If need be, individual churches can get an injunction, file for a declaratory judgment regarding the title to their individual church’s property, and attack the trust. This at least gets us into civil court and brings us under the protection of a civil court so that negotiations can take place in a safer setting to pay an exit fee to the presbytery.
But, why not fight, one last great fight for this great denomination, that is built on a well-educated clergy, with outstanding education offered in our great educational institutions. Historically, this denomination has been politely left of center, but theologically right of center. Our denomination has been traveling the globe with missions and missionaries, and, at one time, maintained its spiritual integrity in Christ, in every part of life and in every step along the journey. We need to do that again. We need to go to the barricades one last time. Every session needs to push their presbytery to join the Constitutional Presbyterians and their ordination standards. If a two-synod church develops, we will still have improved our lot and our freedom and integrity in Christ.
John Almquist
Heaven is where God is, and hell is where he is not
Posted Monday, January 29, 2007
In reply to Meghan Foote of Greeley, Colo. [letter to the editor, posted Jan. 25, 2007], who wrote, “I’m sorry if I misinterpreted your point, but I guess I get nervous when someone suggests that there is something that a human can do that would cause God to stop loving them, even if that human being is Hitler or Saddam Hussein. …”
Everybody wants to talk about God’s love without realizing that God is first holy, righteous, sovereign and just. Therefore, one of the greatest theological minds ever, Paul the apostle, has something to say to this writer’s concern. It was insinuated by some that if God both planned a life and judged it, he might be judged himself to be unjust. Read Romans 9:11-29.
Granted, it is one of those “hard to understand” writings of Paul that the Apostle Peter talked about, but notice what Peter went on to say about Paul’s writings in II Peter 3:15-16. It is wicked people who do wicked things, and they will be cut off from God eternally and never know his love again. God loves, but they will not know it. Hell is a real place, according to Scripture, and it is the extreme opposite of heaven. Heaven is where God is, and hell is where he is not. God is love and light, good, kind, merciful, long-suffering, etc., but if you refuse to know and love him, you will not be in the “congregation of the righteous” or believers.
What can God’s love do for those who have played their part as God, and gone the way of Satan himself? Scripture also says that believers should separate themselves from unbelievers, and as Psalm 2 says, “Blessed is the man that stands not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor sits in the seat of the scornful, but his delight will be in the law of the Lord day and night … but the ungodly are not so … the way of the ungodly will perish. …”
At some point, Jesus said that the disciples were to shake the dust off their shoes from the households that would not receive their message of the gospel. Would you call this love? The one who is love said it.
Hosea 9:15: All their wickedness is in Gilgal: for there I hated them: for the wickedness of their doings I will drive them out of mine house, I will love them no more: all their princes are revolvers.
16: Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea, though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb.
Remember the news reports of Hitler who caused eight million Jews to be gassed, a horrible death, and used their bodies for many inhumane experiments, and caused them to become like walking skeletons, and Saddam Hussein and his sons and henchmen when you read this. I can only say if there was no hell, there would be no justice. Micah 3:1-4 – Malachi 1:1-3
It won’t hurt any of us to remember what God hates. A little fear and trembling at his holiness, righteousness and justice is what the doctor should order for those who call themselves Christians today, yet have no sense of justice, and who do not hunger and thirst after God’s righteousness, who call evil good and good evil, who put evil on the same level as good.
Glenda Smith Asheville, N.C.